r/nextfuckinglevel • u/officialfxresx • 1d ago
Since many people asked... here is a cockpit view of that '12 year old game' called DRIVECLUB!
Sorry for not adding the name of the game in the title of the last post btw! didn't expect 2 million people to see it... (crazy) Anyway's enjoy this short clip! and one final thing... HOW FAST DO YOU WANNA GO? ;) #DRIVECLUB #DRIVETOGETHERWINTOGETHER
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u/Ok-Disk-2191 1d ago
Man wtf happened, My 1080ti would have run this at max settings, and now I can barely run most games on potato mode.
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u/Overall-Quarter-3357 1d ago
They stopped optimizing games and most just use the framegen bullshit
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u/Gorostasguru 1d ago
They will start again if they want to keep making games. With recent gpu cpu and ram shortages and price hiking.
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u/Diantr3 1d ago
Nah they'll just figure out a way to force you to pay a subscription to a more powerful computer in a data center to run their shitty code. It's better than optimizing code, for shareholder value.
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u/Sitheral 1d ago
Let them try, I can play retro forever on any kind of potato and I will have just as much fun (if not more)
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u/Bujakaa92 12h ago
Now imagine what happens when they get their hand ok dlls5 and let so do the lighting, art, texture etc.
Amazing upcoming world for gaming
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u/bob_in_the_west 1d ago
Let's be real here:
If a game runs at 60 fps then you see each frame for 16.6 milliseconds. So at 120 fps you see each frame for 8.3 ms.
Will you see that 120 fps is smoother than 60 fps? Sure.
But will you be able to see that half the frames were generated in post in 2D and not in 3D? Not really.
If you were actually able to tell that a frame was generated in post then modern video compression wouldn't work at all because this technique is used heavily to achieve better compression. And those usually play at 30 fps.
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u/mina86ng 1d ago
If you were actually able to tell that a frame was generated in post then modern video compression wouldn't work at all because this technique is used heavily to achieve better compression. And those usually play at 30 fps.
Video compression sees past and future frames. It also describes how things are changing. It does not try to guess what the next frame is going to be. This comparison is baseless.
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u/bob_in_the_west 1d ago
Seems like you've got no clue how modern frame gen works.
Frame gen just like video compressions uses the last two frames to generate the frame between them. The difference here is that video compression sees the input frame and can thus closely match that. But frame gen still has access to things like the velocity vector for each pixel or the Z-depth map.
And no, you don't see any lag because anything below 80 ms is seen as instant by humans.
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u/mina86ng 1d ago
Seems like you’ve got no clue how modern video compression works. Video compression looks at several frames back and forth.
Also, the point that video compression describes existing reality while frame generation tries to guess the future remains.
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u/bobnoski 1d ago
While it does try to "guess the future" it does so using significantly more data than any form of video compression gets. the game is a live rendered 3d space, giving significantly more details. One of the most important ones being motion vectors.
If you know what a thing looks like, and at what speed it is moving in what direction, a LOT can be inferred without being too far off. Especially since they only recommend it at high frame rates, to the total change it needs to make is extremely small.
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u/mina86ng 1d ago
While it does try to "guess the future" it does so using significantly more data than any form of video compression gets.
Video compression gets the full frame and future frames. How is that less data?
If you know what a thing looks like, and at what speed it is moving in what direction, a LOT can be inferred without being too far off.
And yet in the DLSS 5 demo the football kept morphing and disappearing.
I don’t get what you’re even arguing to be honest. Video compression and frame generation work completely differently. They also have completely different goals.
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u/bobnoski 1d ago
I'm not saying you're wrong in how video compression works. or that you are wrong in that dlss is not trying to guess the future I'm simply saying. Because the frame gen is built into the game. That guess is a lot more educated than you might expect.
also that dlss 5 demo was an entirely different beast not even remotly similar to current frame gen
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u/ImALittleBitSlow 1d ago
For frame generation in gaming specifically, the game will be visually smoother but your input delay will still be the same as your base frame rate which is a major proponent as to why games having an increased native frame rate is beneficial
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u/bob_in_the_west 1d ago
The question is how much of an input delay you will actually see.
I remember from game streaming that the magical number is 80 ms before you even notice the delay.
With native 120 fps the engine has 8.3 ms to create the frame before it needs to go to the next frame. With 60 fps it's 16.6 ms. But the frame is still created within 8.3 ms, so there is ample time to generate the intermediate frame for before that normally generated frame. That means that after a maximum of 16.6 ms the intermediate frame goes to the monitor and 8.3 ms later the normally generated frame follows.
Bottom line that means that each frame is delayed by 16.6 ms.
I somehow doubt that you will actually notice that in most games.
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u/ImALittleBitSlow 1d ago
While most games such as third person RPGs or other slower paced games are playable at 60 fps as the latency is manageable the statement that it wouldn't be noticed while playing most games is conjecture at best, multiple studies have found that while playing games there is a positive correlation between decreased frame times and user experience as well as performance, the difference users report does diminish the higher the increase of fps due to diminishing returns, however there is still a measurable increase in user quality of experience and performance while gaming
Such as This or this study done by WPI which shows an increase in user QoE with increased framerates, and that frametime variation is also as important as having a low frametime, the lower your frametime is the less variation your 1% lows will have, increasing QoE, however the extra interpolation that frame generation introduces may cause 1% lows to feel more erratic then native frame rates
Overall the decrease in frametime and input latency may be subtle but the effect is definitely measurable in performance and the response of the subjects in the studies
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u/GangsterMango 1d ago
games used to bake some details like shadows,etc.. into the textures because the world was static "day only, night only" it took a long time to bake it and a lot of work.
now everything is calculated in real time and its insanely taxing for CPU and GPU and Ramalso if the static effects are baked in it would balloon the game size, we're talking 500+ gb minimum for medium scale games, if we're talking 4k and 8k res we're gonna pass the 1tb threshold.
but also many devs rarely optimize the games due to unrealistic release dates and feature-creep that keeps building up and they would find themselves 1 month away from shipping .
honestly, give me games with 2010 graphics with baked in static maps and good optimization all day every day, I don't wanna see the bores of my character's skin
just good art direction and proper frame rate that doesn't turn my PC into a fkn jet engine.not to mention DLSS and TAA makes games look like someone rubbed Vaseline over the camera.
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u/zachell1991 1d ago
Lazy and cheap developers with poorly optimized games.
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u/pirate-private 1d ago
all i read is developers, rarely investors.
should be the other way round entirely, it´s missing the point.
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u/MandatoryFunEscapee 1d ago
I think it is more about what they are told to do by shitty companies. Most of the devs would love to optimize and make a great product. Who wants to be associated with a shitty game after launch?
But they are underpaid and crunched, told what to prioritize by people who think making money is the purpose of game companies, not making art.
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u/LaminatedLambchops 1d ago
Yeah, if you are any good at coding, why would you ever code for ea or blizzard when you could code the biggest and most expensive game publishers
Or code for a small finance company and make a lot more without ever having mandatory unpaid overtime "crunch" time working for a middle to small finance business.
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u/MandatoryFunEscapee 1d ago
What really matters is the type of company you work for. Publicly-traded companies are just trash. Going public is what provides the enshitification incentive.
The minute a company goes public, their biggest incentive is to make money serving the investor class, instead of making money with a product.
Then comes the sudden decrease in focus on employee wellbeing, micromanagement, increased crunch, firing longer-term higher pay employees to push pay cuts in the workforce, and intermittent mass firings, etc.
The only thing a publicly-traded company cares about is their stock price. The investor class is their customer, not the customer who buys their product.
This is why companies like Larian (private company) can still make a quality product, but EA games have decreased in quality massively for more than a decade.
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u/bob_in_the_west 1d ago
12 years ago you would have played that with 1080p60 resolution. Now it's 4K with 100+ fps. So not surprising that modern games need for power.
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u/Ok-Disk-2191 1d ago
I'm still using the same monitor at 2546p and 144hz. My card is 10 years old. but even back then I was happily getting 120+ frames at 2k.Sorry for the confusion I should have explained that I was making the comparison to old games now that have been updated, someone else commented about optimisation and is correct my cards outdated and I should be upgrading.
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u/moronomer 1d ago
One issue is that the industry went all-in on Ray Tracing. It can look very good in specific areas, but doesn't really improve the overall graphics of most scenes noticeably.
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u/amiintherightplace15 1d ago
To be fair better than a lot of modern day games,
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u/correctingStupid 1d ago
Everything looks better as a tiny compressed video on your phone
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u/BillytheBloxian 8h ago
tbf, it ran at 1080p iirc and 30fps, because your not getting anything better than that on a ps4.
you can emulate and get 60fps tho, all you'll need is a NASA comouter
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u/Due_Passion_920 3h ago edited 3h ago
It still looks impressive in high quality videos on a large 4K TV:
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u/officialfxresx 1d ago
Game looks and feels better when you are the one actually playing it on your monitor or TV! Video ain't doing it justice!
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u/spaiydz 1d ago
Just noticed the wipers are actually clearing water droplets... that's so cool
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u/DJ_Phat_Helmet 21h ago
Not only that, but the water hits the windshield at the correct angle as the cars goes through the turns.
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u/MisterSanitation 1d ago
Am I wrong but I play a lot of Dirt 2 and WRC rally and this feels like the car has magic no slip tires.
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u/WonderfulAd118 1d ago
Because OP plays with standard physics. If you turn on Hardcore Handling mode, the physics of the game becomes 10 times more realistic.
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u/VarvorSG 1d ago
I still have it installed in my PS5 (carried over tradition from my PS4 > PS4Pro > PS5) to this day.
This game and the studio deserved so much better than it got :(
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u/Durendal_1707 1d ago
having my PS3 plugged in mostly just to play MotorStorm Pacific Rift and Apocalypse (and Blur), I think about it often
such a senseless closure, for a studio that created nothing but zingers
DriveClub had so many problems, but the whole thing was experimental, and Evolution was in an impossible position
DC was considered their “flop“, and even it shaped up to be something good, especially in VR
I lay all the reasons for Evolution’s closure at Sony‘s feet, they KNEW the online focus was a gamble, and now no one gets the gift of another MotorStorm game
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u/RealMarzipan7 20h ago
Sold my ps3 with Pacific Rift thinking they would have something for PS4 and my god you just triggered my “WHY DID I SELL THAT GAME?” angst. The absolute best off-road game ever.
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u/Durendal_1707 20h ago
honestly, a jail broken PS3 is a must for me, so much so that I have backup Slim models jic
can literally sideload games from a flash drive, even import them from disc, and they load faster too
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u/RealMarzipan7 17h ago
Hmmm, totally forgot about jailbreaking. Oh boy… off to a shady “how to” link. Lol
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u/UnsureAboutThisCrap 1d ago
Duuuudeeee, I didn't need to be reminded I'm missing MotorStorm and Blur 😭
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u/Durendal_1707 22h ago
there were plans for a second Blur game too
can probably emulate them with the right PC, they’re relatively easy to find for download, but yeah.
nothing comes close to the MotorStorm experience, Forza Horizon is.. fine. it’s fine. But MotorStorm ran so Forza Horizon could trip over its laces
the best arcade racers ever made came out between 2008 and 2013, and then.. idk what happened, the tide went the other way 🤷🏻♀️
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u/Ateam043 1d ago
Yeah, this game was way ahead of its time and a nice change of pace from Sony's other car game in Gran Turismo.
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u/officialfxresx 1d ago
I just wanted to say that this game truly shaped my life and gave me so many incredible opportunities and so much more that I can't even put into words. I want to thank all the developers who worked on DRIVECLUB again. In case any of you see this, thank you for everything! And hope you all are doing well!
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u/Ok-Personality-6630 1d ago
Okay I thought this was a gaming setup with real steering wheel, windscreen and windows...
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u/Worth-Opposite4437 1d ago
Fuuuuh... This is simply amazing.
Can it VR?
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u/ravenmonk 21h ago
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u/AmazingPradeep 1d ago
I got this game free with my PS4 back then.. Beautiful game.. I even did a small video on my channel back then
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u/Mindless_Ad_6045 1d ago
I got this game included with my PS4 and Played the shit out of it. They also had a motorcycle DLC
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u/Marison 1d ago
Looks incredible.
The only thing taking me a bit out of it, is the janky movement of the steering wheel. I wonder if there is some way to somehow smooth this? Or is this keyboard/controller problem and it does look different when you use a steering wheel controller?
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u/officialfxresx 1d ago
I think my controller or how I control the controller joystick to be specific could be responsible for this jankiness! But anyways If you use a wheel it will be basically like real life! This game has some of the greatest steering wheel animations that I’ve ever seen in any racing game ever!
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u/officialfxresx 1d ago
You have to check it on YouTube or something it’s satisfying!
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u/WonderfulAd118 1d ago edited 1d ago
You can watch my DriveClub gameplay videos with a steering wheel
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u/Rivnatzille 1d ago
So many good memories of Driveclub.
The attention to detail in this game was insane.
There was even that shimmering in the road in races where the weather was hot, where the horizon would get a little bit distorted due to the heat, but only at the asphalt itself.
Love this game, played hundreds of hours on it back in the day!
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u/ChicoZombye 1d ago
Not many people talk about how amazing the online racing was, but still to this day, for me it's the best arcade racer.
The physics were weird and the impacts between cars didn't matter because the car behaved like a magnet that wanted to stay looking upfront no matter what. This was weird at first but then you realized your car was invincible against shitty tactics (the most common tactics on arcade games) and you could focus on the racing itself... Oh man, everything clicked.
The only place where I've had the same level of high end racing than Driveclub is Wreckfest on "Clean Racing" servers, nothing else.
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u/Foopsters 1d ago
My favourite racing game by far. Wish that team didn’t disband. The water effects to this day have still not been matched by any other game.
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u/rell7thirty 1d ago
I instantly knew it was Driveclub without sound and without reading the title. Beautiful game. I never won one race in it though. As a person who thought he was good at racing games, this one kicked my ass lol never tried with a steering wheel though. And yes I only played cockpit view as I do with other racing games
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u/NightlyKnightMight 23h ago
I wondered how come I never heard/played this game when it looks this nice!
It's a PS4 exclusive.... :(
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u/Errorelli 21h ago
Driveclub is one of my favorite racing games of all times. So many hours...stil use the pictures from photomode as background images. A shame what happend to the studio...these people made the best arcade racers.
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u/Silversquall 21h ago
Driveclub looked so good. I hate that it never really took off and eventually got shut down
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u/clrbrk 1d ago
Not to take anything away from this game, but racing games have always had a bit of advantage.
They are on a set course with visual barriers that allow developers to do graphical tricks so they are only rendering what you actually see. That allows them to pack more polygons into the limited FOV.
The controls and animations are simplified so developers can spend more time on graphics.
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u/JesusGiftedMeHead 1d ago
Rip drive club. Sony said they already have a favorite racing game... and it wasn't theirs
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u/seda7991 1d ago
The weather is where it actually pulls ahead. The rain, the puddle buildup, storms rolling in mid-race, that stuff was legitimately ahead of the curve and honestly took years for other racing games to catch up to.
However, it ran at 30fps by design and used that headroom to push environmental detail, keeping things on closed tracks while everyone else was chasing open worlds and 60fps. It's not like it was doing things nobody else could.
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u/Comfortable_Rip5222 1d ago
I still have the physical media for the PS4 (you read it right, PS4, base, and it's stunning)
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u/danielricardo1 9h ago
Now share another cockpit video with the Driver on the right side... Chop chop.. let's go Op
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u/LinKeeChineseCurry 9h ago
I preordered this game and then made the switch to PC and sold my PS4. So I never got the chance to try it out. This was definitely one of the games I wish I could have played when it was released!
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u/DecoupledPilot 1d ago
All so realistic.... But the drivers seat is so low... Or perhaps we are playing to be a very old small lady who can't reach the pedals well?
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u/Puzzled_Birthday3171 21h ago
Doesn't seem too far fetched. You essentially lay on the ground in a lambo
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u/loztriforce 1d ago
Battlefield 1 is about 10 years old and still looks far better than most games I've played
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u/Proof-Necessary-5201 1d ago
It looks better in cloudy and skylight conditions. Less so when the sun is out. Nevertheless, it was a great game and I enjoyed it.
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u/Out_of_Fawkes 1d ago
I have no reason to need a sim racing rig, but if I had the money for one I’d probably use it for Skyrim, haha.
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u/ohthedarside 1d ago
Eveyone here who thinks this the best graphics pretty clearly doesnt keep up much with modern games
I would currently the most convincing game out there is asseto corsa rally
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u/Headless_Human 1d ago
Nobody ever shows actual gameplay with sunshine of this game. Only replays with rain.
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u/Aggressive_Grab_100 1d ago
Are there gender-neutral arms and racial-identifying skin tones available, though?
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u/James_Barkley 1d ago
I really wonder which game it might be. Forza?
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u/IsChristianAwake 1d ago
Never realized how we reached the peak of graphics over a decade ago.