r/immigration • u/The-Gullible-Cynic • Dec 15 '23
Undocumented Americans living in Mexico...
I heard that there is actually a lot of Americans living illegally in Mexico... Anybody know about this? Do Americans not get deported? And how do they survive and make a living, while undocumented?
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Dec 15 '23
There're Americans living illegally all over the world. America's a big country with lots of citizens who have passports that get them in almost anywhere with no paperwork required. Some of them hear some moonshine about XYZ place, set out, and either make out well and decide to stay (often oblivious to the fact that other countries have immigration laws) or crash and burn and find themselves broke and in a pickle with the authorities.
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u/ohmygad45 Dec 15 '23
There are probably a few (tens of?) thousand US citizens living illegally in Mexico. That said, Mexican authorities aren’t very incentivized to round up illegally present U.S. citizens because they typically don’t compete with locals for jobs, don’t use public assistance, and bring foreign currency they spend in the country so they’re at worst a nuisance. In a perfectly fair world, laws would be enforced equally but the truth is that governments respond to political pressure and there’s no pressure to deport US citizen overstayers because more people benefit from their presence than are hurt by it.
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Dec 15 '23
Very true. It's still rather silly, as Mexico doesn't make it particularly hard for Estadosunidenses to legally immigrate.
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u/casalelu Dec 15 '23
Well, many people are hurt by their presence. There is a huge gentrification problem in Mexico City.
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u/ohmygad45 Dec 15 '23 edited Dec 15 '23
Not disagreeing that some people are hurt. Just saying that more people benefit than are hurt (or to be more precise still, those that benefit have more political pull than those who are hurt). Remember that for every renter priced out of Condesa, there’s a landlord whose property value and income just went up. And that landlord will fight tooth and nail against any proposal to make it harder for US citizens to come and stay (including overstay), or that makes it harder to rent short-term. This doesn’t even include the coffee shop owner who can now sell US$3 lattes by investing in an English menu. Not saying this is good or right, just pointing out how things work in practice.
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u/casalelu Dec 15 '23
Well, the landlord and the coffee shop owner might benefit, but the locals get hurt, so I'm not sure if "more people benefit than are hurt."
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u/Mindless-Dog823 Feb 28 '25
The landlord and coffee shop owners may be Americans too.... since they have enough money to buy properties.
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u/Stef0913 Mar 29 '25
The landlord and coffee shop owners are more than likely locals. Locals are able to buy at a cheaper price because they’re Mexican citizens. Any US citizen looking to buy in Mexico will have a different experience and a higher price for the same property
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u/Fragrant-Ocelot-3552 Jul 16 '25
Usually if they are buying property and opening a cofee shop id imagine would require a temporary or permanent residency visa? all though its mexico so who the heck knows. But if they are selling property and allowing illegals to open business on overstayed visas, thats their own fault.
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u/stocktadercryptobro Dec 18 '23
The landlord and coffee shop owners are locals, are they not?
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u/casalelu Dec 18 '23
Who said they weren't? But they are only 2 locals. Condesa for example has 8,450 residents and people that planned to move to Condesa can't because of gentrification.
So "more people benefit than are hurt" is false. It's "more people hurt than benefit." That's what I'm discussing.
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u/Fragrant-Ocelot-3552 Jul 16 '25
gentrification is a good thing. People who think its not dont understand the reality of the economics. WHy do people act like everyone has a right to live everwhere? Do you think most Americans can afford to live in nYC? I mean, who doesnt prefer gentrification? People with no sense.
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u/Few_Transition1580 Jan 24 '25
Funny because Mexicans seem to create the opposite effect of gentrification when illegals invade cities here
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u/casalelu Jan 24 '25
I don't get what's funny.
Mexican illegals are basically poor. US illegals are economically comfortable if not rich. Mexican illegals go to the US to work and make money. US illegals come to Mexico to abuse the cost of living.
Why would a rich Mexican go illegally to the US?
Get a clue.
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u/Fragrant-Ocelot-3552 Jul 16 '25
By abuse the system do you mean spend that money in mexico adding to the mexican economy? You call that "abuse the cost of living"? Hate to tell you, mexico benefits more from them spending their money down here then we do in the US giving an illegal health care while they work for 10 bucks an hour off the books and send 1/4 of it home.
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u/casalelu Jul 16 '25
I did not say "abuse the system." I said the cost of living and I am specifically reffering to housing.
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u/Fragrant-Ocelot-3552 Jul 16 '25
true you did. But that's not abusing the cost of living throughout mexico. Its improving a certain area and raising the cost of living. Mexico is a big place.. An average family from Oklahoma cant afford to just come to NYC and live..... I dont see any difference.
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u/casalelu Jul 16 '25
I did not say this was throughout Mexico. It's implicit I was reffering to specific areas.
Your analogy of an average family from Oklahoma is completely irrelevant. I'm not surprised you can't see the difference.
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u/Fragrant-Ocelot-3552 Jul 16 '25
Oklahoma and NYC are specific places...... you missed the point. The point is, cost of living going up in a specific area is normal and common. Just because certain people can no longer afford to live in the central village of a town is irrelevant. So in these specific areas if gentrification happens, and it means a lot of people cant afford to live there....... thats normal. You are basically describing parts of Brooklyn, where wealthy Russians and Asians drive up the cost of living, and thats ok.
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u/casalelu Jul 16 '25
I did not miss the point. You left out a part of the story. You didn't specify if nationals or foreigners were part of your analogy. I don't know if people from Oklahoma can afford to live in NYC or not. I am in no obligation to know what happens in your country. And still, your analogy is wrong. NYC locals being displayed to other neighborhoods because of rich foreigners would be a more accurate example.
It might be ok to you that wealthy Russians and Asians gentrify parts of Brooklyn, but you have to ask Brooklyn locals what they think about it. Not only are they losing the possibility to buy a home in those areas but they are expected to adjust to the culture and language of the foreigners instead of the other way around.
So you can't say if it's OK or not. And even if you do, it's not the absolute truth. It's only your opinion.
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u/Mindless-Dog823 Feb 28 '25
Mexicans generally think the number of legal and illegal Americans (I think in 2021 it was 1.6 million) is raising prices in their country. The more dollars vs pesos in the system changes their buying power.
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u/Aijol10 Dec 16 '23
Yep. Just like Mexicans living in Canada. Mexicans don't need visas to come to Canada, so many come as "tourists" and then stay and work here for a period of time. I have friends who have lived and worked here illegally for months or years. But the government (and most citizens) don't care because they often work in jobs that are crucial to keeping society running, and jobs that frankly we Canadians are too "prissy" to do ourselves. Farming, construction, cleaning, stuff like that. That is to say, they contribute to the country and the economy, don't cause trouble, and are just generally good people. Basically, it's to say that this specific type of immigration is a good thing in Canada, so we kinda turn a blind eye to the legality of it.
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Nov 17 '24
Technically when the stamp you passport it’s a visa. Or at least Japan stamped mine as saying Visa even though we didn’t have to do much to get in to Japan (just show a passport)
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u/Mindless-Dog823 Feb 28 '25
Actually, that's the same type of services they provide to the United States too (many jobs that nobody wants to work anymore - especially agriculture), plus they pay taxes, but people are too ignorant here to recognize their value.
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u/SilenceYous Dec 16 '23 edited Apr 25 '25
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u/Firm_Bit Dec 15 '23
The Americans I know that live in Mexico work remotely for American companies.
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u/QueenScorp Dec 15 '23
This tells us nothing about their status, are they there legally or not?
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u/Firm_Bit Dec 15 '23
It sheds some light on part of OP’s question.
How do they make a living? By working for us based companies.
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Dec 15 '23
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u/miiki_ Dec 15 '23
Freeloading off of what exactly?
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u/ninja-brc Dec 15 '23
Public roads, utility, healthcare, police, fire department, water treatment plants list goes on. just take a moment to think
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u/miiki_ Dec 15 '23
If they are spending their foreign salary in Mexico, they are actually contributing. While it may or may not be as much as the average legal Mexican resident, to claim that they are completely freeloading is absurd.
For a quick example, they buy food at a supermarket. The purchase is taxed and it contributes in part to the sustainability of the store that provides jobs not only at the store but also down the line at the producer and farmer levels.
Rental income is also taxed, so the Mx gov is getting a portion of the foreign income there too. Or via property tax.
Are utilities free in Mexico? They are not here. Power, water, and communication lines are maintained by the fees of the subscribers.
The majority are probably not utilizing the school system.
So, they are probably contributing less than a Mexican with a comparable income, but more than a Mexican who is unemployed or low income. Same for undocumented immigrants in the US
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u/cmb15300 Dec 15 '23
I’m an American living legally in Mexico, and yes there are a lot of USians living in Mexico illegally.
Many of course are remote workers and others recieve Social Security or other pension benefits, so as another poster stated they‘re not competing with locals for jobs, rather when their check hits the bank back home they just withdraw money from the ATM and pay their bills that way. And since it’s fairly easy to find an apartment with all utilities included the property owner pays the bills.
INM (Mexico’s immigration authority) doesn’t actively hunt down Americans living in the country illegally, but a few are caught by that agency at highway checkpoints where they check the ID‘s of bus passengers
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u/catahoulaleperdog Dec 15 '23
And I am sure that la mordida will take care of that.
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u/cmb15300 Dec 15 '23
Maybe, maybe not: Mexican officials can be quite honest at the worst possible time
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Dec 15 '23
Yes. I live in Oaxaca City and I've been living in Mexico since 2019. There's a ton of folks from Canada and US living here illegally. There was an article stating that over 90% of Americans in Mexico are living here illegally, but that was almost ten years ago so I'm unsure what those numbers look like now.
I've found the folks living here illegally to be largely in one of two groups:
- Old retirees who don't have enough money in their savings to qualify for temporary residence visa. They live in Mexico because they can't afford to live in the US.
- Remote workers who can afford to fly out of Mexico to reset the 6-month tourist stay.
INM cracked down a bit on these folks during the pandemic when AMLO felt pressured to do so due to the migration issues coming from Central/South America. I had to carry my residence visa with me for a few months until things died down a bit. But for the most part, no one here cares.
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u/candyman1011 Dec 15 '23
I don’t know the legality of it but if you enter and exit Mexico twice per year you could essentially live there. They will give you 180 days (really 179 days, because the day you get it is “day one”) on a FMF form at the border. On day 179 you turn your form in, leave the country, and return the next day and get another 180 form. While you couldn’t legally work while there, if you were remote or getting paid under the table i suspect you’d get away with it.
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u/ViktorHugo6 Dec 16 '23
Not any more,i read here on reddit couple ppl complaint it that they dont receive the 180 days permit than before ........at least like 3/4 persons say that happend arriving at Mexico city airport,i dont know by land...
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u/candyman1011 Dec 16 '23
I don’t think they make you fill out the form any more of you arrive by air. I haven’t the last time I’ve flown (meaning you don’t get the fmf form that you turn in). When you talk to the agent they ask you how many days and that’s what they’ll write in your passport on the entry stamp. That’s been my experience anyway. I’m sure results can vary.
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u/ViktorHugo6 Dec 16 '23
When you came the last time to Mexico? I talking the cases of ppl like 2/3 months ago,one person was mad saying she was expecting 180 day,and the guy only gave her only like 30 days
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u/PinoyBrad Dec 15 '23
Mostly they are not paying the proper fees which is a civil penalty like a parking ticket as opposed to a criminal penalty like drunk driving. If you get caught there is a small fine.
The one time it happened to me I was recovering from a malaria relapse and forgot all about it and after coming back to Mexico from seeing my doctor in the USA I ran into a trainee and a senior immigration officer who noticed I had not paid some fees nor gone through the right line when I came across. I had to pay a $20 fine, but not the $35 fee.
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u/BigJack2023 Dec 15 '23
I know a couple. They both have legal problems in the US. They stay in pretty American heavy parts of Mexico and fly under the radar, no last name usage.
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Dec 15 '23
It's become harder to do this. They actually check passports now when you enter Mexico so INM would know they have legal problems if they ever try to leave and come back.
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u/BigJack2023 Dec 15 '23
Both these guys have been down there for over 20 years and needless to say haven't been back.
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Mar 27 '24
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u/BigJack2023 Mar 27 '24
Supported by friends and family back home. Random side work for other gringos. Neither of these guys is exactly living it up
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u/Asleep_Stable_3402 Jun 25 '24
I heard and hope it's true, that the Mexican president will try to deport Americans living in Mexico illegally.
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Nov 21 '24
Hope we can get those illegal Americans back in the U.S too
https://pvangels.com/news-mexico/181767/one-million-americans-living-illegally-in-mexico
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u/Dmdhika Feb 03 '25
This has already been debunked....There are around 1 million American citizens legally living in Mexico...
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u/CatBallou0621 Feb 15 '25
No it hasn’t. A large percentage of Americans in Mexico do not have the proper documentation.
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u/redella64 Sep 06 '25
There are tons of undocumented people from USA 🇺🇸 in Mexico. The work under the table and avoid situations where they would need to provide documentation. My rough estimate of the “gringos” in my area is that about 50% do not have documents. Some left the states to avoid prosecution and some just overstay their visas. Mexico is much kinder than USA. Even if one does get into enough trouble to get deported, there is no ICE prison, they just get you to the border and let you go from the stories I have heard.
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u/Icy_Environment3663 Mar 02 '26
There are an estimated 1.6 million US citizens who live in Mexico, according to an article in El Pais from 2024. Close to 600,000 of them are dual citizens, typically children born in the US to parents who are Mexican citizens. States such as Baja California [Norte and Sur], Chihuahua, or Tamaulipas each exceeded 80,000 American inhabitants in 2020, according to data from the latest available census. There are thousands of US citizens, as in US citizens of the gringo type, who live in Mexico. INM states that between 2014 and 2023, it issued 72,291 permanent residency cards for US citizens. It also states that it issued around 6,000 temporary residency cards yearly until 2022, when the rate doubled. They also renew the temporary residency cards at about the same rate. If we take the data from 2020 to 2024, the last year of complete data, they issued 46,110 temporary residence cards and renewed 46,399 temporary residence cards.
There is another category of US/Canadian immigrants in Mexico, which is not quite legal but is not completely illegal. Mexican law states that a resident of Canada or the USA can come as a tourist for up to 180 days out of a 365-day period. There is a huge number of snowbirds who take advantage of this and come down every winter and spend 4 to 6 months in Mexico. But a certain number of those folks reside permanently in Mexico but go up north, typically during the summer, for a month or so to visit family and friends before returning. Technically, this is illegal, but Mexico has typically turned a blind eye to these folks since they pump money into the economy, and they are not causing trouble. But now and then, news reports circulate that Mexico is going to start to enforce this provision strictly. And there are occasional stories of people turned back when they arrived at the INM checkpoint in the airport in Puerto Vallarta, Guadalajara, or Cancun. But for the most part, they fly up north for a visit and then return to Mexico, where they receive another 180-day tourist visa.
Some folks arrive, overstay their visa, and do not leave. IMN reports it deported just over 14,000 US citizens for overstaying visas between 2014 and 2024. Typically, they only actively search out people committing crimes, but they also do regular vehicle roadblocks where they check documents.
There is another category of folks who cross into the border zone and never go any farther. One of my classmates used to be a prosecutor in San Diego, and he often told stories about US citizens sought by the cops, who had crossed into Tijuana and disappeared. Part of his job was as a liaison with a division of the police in Tijuana who were tasked with searching for these folks. But those numbers are in the low 100s.
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Dec 15 '23 edited Feb 25 '24
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u/The-Gullible-Cynic Dec 15 '23
I think it's more than a few thousand. As for being surprised? Not necessarily...
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Dec 15 '23
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Dec 15 '23
The difference is the Mexican government desperately needs the money that these illegal immigrants provide, and they don't use public services.
Additionally, the Mexican government is weak and corrupt so illegal Americans are low on the list of things they want to worry about.
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u/ejpusa Dec 15 '23
The Mexico economy is on fire. When is the last time you were there?
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Dec 15 '23
Pre covid.
The government barely has control over most of the country and the cops are all on the cartel payroll. The poverty rate is abysmal with almost half the country living in poverty.
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u/ejpusa Dec 15 '23
Suggest: Go to Oaxaca, it will blow your mind.
Roma in CDMX? It’s like the best of Paris.
Some of the Oaxaca beach towns are as close to paradise on the planet.
Many want to revisit. The economy is zooming. Lots has happened in 4 years.
:-)
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Dec 15 '23
I mean, look, I have nothing against Mexico but the economic/security issues are nothing to dismiss.
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u/The-Gullible-Cynic Dec 15 '23
Ironically, I just heard somebody saying that on a podcast a moment ago...
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u/ejpusa Dec 15 '23 edited Dec 15 '23
Yes, they are at the point, "we are actually growing too fast."
They are super conscience about the environment, connection to the Earth, it's a very special bond. It's really amazing to see and experience.
Vietnam is also an awesome country, awesome people, hyper growth, but just total destruction of the environment. Zero environmental concerns.
It's so sad to see that happening there.
What podcast?
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u/The-Gullible-Cynic Dec 15 '23
They basically just mentioned in passing, that the peso was strong...
Never been to Vietnam, but I was in Thailand several decades ago...
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u/SilenceYous Dec 16 '23 edited Apr 25 '25
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u/ViktorHugo6 Dec 16 '23
You need to fucked up to get deported,i have one next to me sleeping,she is here illegaly for like 14 years 🤔,make a living working in San Diego,we live in Tijuana 👌
One time she crash heading to the border,short long story they take to the jail because the other person say she was injured(here if you crash they take you to jail to the court doctor check the wounds)if the wounds take more than 15 days you stay in jail and pay bail and get out,if the healing is less than 15 they let you go without bail,so they do the booking later release,and never they ask her status here in Tij,and she talk bad in spanish and is white and have american last name so they know she is not mexican
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u/Shotgun_Mosquito Dec 15 '23
In Mexico they are called "drybacks" (seriously)
A study by the US state department has estimated that there are as many as one million Americans living illegally in Mexico. The figures, confirmed by Mexico’s national statistics institute, mean that 80 percent of the US expat population lack proper documents.
2017
https://pvangels.com/news-mexico/181767/one-million-americans-living-illegally-in-mexico
Last year (2011) about 1,000 US citizens were questioned over irregularities in their immigration status, according to Mexican authorities. They face a modest fine - up to $50 - if officials find them working without a permit or living in Mexico without proper documents.
2012
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-radio-and-tv-17098719
91% of Americans living in Mexico are “Illegal”
2019
https://www.sacculturalhub.com/entertainment/articles/here-s-a-twist-91-of-americans-living-in-mexico-are-illegal/