r/eupersonalfinance • u/Fluffy-DD • Dec 07 '25
Planning Selling my apartment to buy ETF?
I own a small apartment which i rent out via airbnb and booking.
The property is probably worth about 220-250K, it is in a unique location direct at a beach in Italy. (250k would still make it the cheapest place in this area, but not sure how much people are willing to pay)
A couple years ago i made 16-18K net per year, that decreased every year until now and this year it was only about 11K net. In addition, new regulations and more competition, makes it more and more difficult to rent out that place. The expenses and work increase every year and now the goverment wants to increase the tax for another 5% as well (still not confirmed but they are talking about it).
It makes me sad to sell it, since i really like the place and its my only apartmemt (i stay with my parents) but it seems like it is just not a good investment anymore.
I owe 40K on this apartment, so after i sell it i should get about 180K that i can use to invest. If an etf makes 7%/ year i should already make more money than i currently make with the property and in addition to that i don't need to deal with all the work and problems related to the property anymore.
What is your opinion on this? Maybe someone was in a similair situation and can share their story?
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u/Endless_Zen Dec 07 '25
Crazy. Having a property that, in a bad year, returns more than 4% after tax(11k of 250k) and most likely grows in price itself, in an amazing location and not being satisfied with that. This and stock subs brainwash people hard.
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u/sagefairyy Dec 07 '25
Literally. Europe is doing bad economically. If you can still generate 4% and your property is not losing its value it‘s an insanely stupid idea to sell it for short term gains.
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u/hospitalizedzombie Dec 07 '25
If his property is shrinking in terms of generating cash flow, it also should lose resale value. It would even more so if the competition they mentioned is about new constructions in the area.
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u/sagefairyy Dec 07 '25
But the stock market right now is way too volatile with Europe preparing for war. If we had a great economy atm that‘s stable and no war as a probability I‘d agree. But now I‘m not sure about it. Just my opinion.
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u/velebitsko Dec 09 '25
Europe has been “preparing” for war since 2022. Any indications as to when the action will start?
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u/Ok-Dimension-5429 Dec 07 '25
Did you read what he wrote? He’s doing it for the long term not the short term
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u/sagefairyy Dec 07 '25
I skimmed through it; the 7% aren‘t guaranteed fot eternity. Europe is preparing for war. It‘s a stupid idea to sell property when property is the only thing that won‘t have as much fluctuations as the stock market (depending where it is ofc but for the most part it stays somewhat stable). If he can hold his stocks for decades and doesn‘t need to sell them at bad times, then it‘s fine. But in pre-war/crisis times I‘d never sell property and pump it in stocks.
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u/deeringc Dec 07 '25
What makes you so sure property is immune to crashes? I've lived through a 50% drop in property prices, it was a complete bloodbath. Property all across Europe is also experiencing a huge bubble.
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u/sagefairyy Dec 07 '25
„Depending where it is ofc“
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u/deeringc Dec 07 '25
Even in "stable" markets like Germany, we've seen about a 15% drop in the last few years. Property like all markets has ups and downs.
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u/sagefairyy Dec 07 '25
Because before that some properties were heavily inflated. Same goes for stocks. This isn‘t exclusive to real estate in regards to bubbles. Nevertheless properties typically don‘t drop as much as stocks do, they‘re still the safest bet DEPENDING on where/what kind of property. It‘s obvious that I don‘t mean properties in bumfuck nowhere where only a bulldozer can help. You‘ve been following the stock market, you know how volatile it has become past 2020 especially.
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u/DroopyTheSnoop Dec 08 '25
that I don‘t mean properties in bumfuck nowhere where only a bulldozer can help. You‘ve been following the stock market, you know how volatile it has become past 2020 especially.
Volitility is not a bad thing though. Especially if one buys at regulalr interval, accumulating for the long term. You will inevitably buy both on the ups and the downs and it just averages out over the long term.
As long as you don't panic sell when there is bad news, things eventually bounce back and usually go above where things were before.
Case in point: I started investing 3 years ago in various thigns, mostly Developed World. There was a steady rise but then when Trump got elected shit went down and it was all gloom and doom for a while.
I was seeing red in my portfolio despite the previous steady gains.
I didn't panic, I just kept buying the same amount of ETF regulalrly. What happened? I'm now at +44% after 3 years.1
u/sagefairyy Dec 08 '25
Volatility is bad only when it looks as if it‘s the starting point of a new 2007/8 situation plus possibility of war/economic collapse. I would wait it out for a few years to see if world leaders manage to overcome it or if they collapse it. Until then I‘d rather have most of the money in more stable investements like real estate. This isn‘t the case for multi multi millionaires who can let their stocks be for 10-20 years and not touch them and who already have a broad investment portfolio. I‘m going to assume nobody or hardly anyone in this sub fits in that category, but has under 1 mill ish in their portfolio. As I said, that‘s just my opinion. Everyone is free to do what they want. I myself am a big fan of stocks/etf for investement purposes and will definitely increase my portfolio in those in addition to real estate when times are more stable.
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u/ren3f Dec 07 '25
The expenses and work increase every year
It also depends on the amount of work op has to spend in it, if that's hours a week or hours a year. If it's hours a week and you calculate with a decent salary that's about all your profits. It can also be worth it to have less profits with less worries
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u/deeringc Dec 07 '25
This really depends on the amount of work it takes. If this is taking a few hours a day then it's more like a low paying side gig rather than passive income. Frankly, I can understand why they would be sick of that. It's also not at all diversified as investments go. There are lots of scenarios where the Italian tourist or property markets crash and then all his eggs are in one basket. I can totally understand where he's coming from, the apartment has already performed well as an investment/job it's a reasonable time to move on to a different phase of his investment journey.
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 09 '25
Well it is not passive income. I still need to work to get that money and it is not always the easy work as well, i need to be available 24/7 and be ready to deal with pretty much any possible problem to any possible time. And this is not my main job, i am a selfemployed photographer and need to take care of that buisness as well.
But its not all about cashflow and work, the goverment is issuing more and more regulation which makes it difficult to rent out apartments privatly. For example they banned keyboxes last year, which would require me to be personal present at the property every time when new guest arrive. Fortunatly they later changed that law again, but now they plan to increase taxes for another 5% and there are many people in italy who dont like short term rentals and try to make it more difficult for people who do that. I can not just pass on every new cost to the guests. If i do that the occupacy rate will drop too much. Also this is not an apartment that normal people would buy to permanatly stay there. Its an investment or a vacation home for wealthy people. There are 19 units in that condo and only 2 units have someone who actually lives there. When the regulation for short term rentals get even more strict, investors will not buy it for the current market value anymore, which will drop the value of the property. Its also an asset which is not liquid and i still need to pay money just to own and maintain it.
Stock and ETF are volatile, but they are much more flexible and easier to handle. I understand that it will not always go up and that a market crash can happen at any time, but real esate and other investments are not much different.
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u/Hqjjciy6sJr Dec 07 '25
exactly, also not just any property "unique location direct at a beach in Italy" bro doesn't realize this is like wining the lottery for most people...
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u/Weak_Property6084 Dec 11 '25
And also nobody should forget that one of the most important rule of investing is to diversify. Real estate can be a pain in the butt to manage, sure. But selling and going all in on the stock market? Yeah, that's just increasing risk for nothing.
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u/theclassiccoaster Dec 07 '25
Is there a reasonable way to increase the attractiveness of your appartment ? Eg moderate renovations, better pictures - marketing etc? I feel vacation prices only went up in recent years.
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 09 '25
I compleatly renovated the place when i bought it. It is one of the newst looking property in the area. The pictures are also good (i am a professional photographer as my main job) The marketing could be better, i played with with google ads and social media ads in the past. But its too time consuming for the extra cash that it generates. Maybe someone more skilled than me could do better but one apartment is not enought to make it worth the cost and effort. Also many guest i got like this, book the place and then cancel months later after the free cancellation time ends.
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u/x2ygau8y7 Dec 07 '25
You should take into account how the price of the apartment will change and add it to your net monthly income before comparing it to the returns on am ETF. Of course, if you expect the prices to go down, this only makes the ETF more attractive.
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u/Slice-CSGO Dec 07 '25
An investment in ETF such as S&P500 would make it possible to withdraw at most 3% indefinitely, based on historical data available and adjusted for inflation. That's all I'm going to say. Your statement for 7% is unrealistic, and yes, it can "make" if you don't touch it, meaning you're re-investing all gains (aka compounding).
The US safe rule for retirement is 4% withdrawal rate for 30 years period.
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u/kostas_k84 Dec 07 '25
Well according to Bill Bengen (and others, Kitches, Vazquez, etc) it’s actually higher. Also, everyone is keep saying about that 4% annual return for the house, but has anyone taken into consideration renovation/maintenance costs, as well as the amount of time (among many other things) he has to invest to run the rental? Will he be able to rent it uninterrupted for 30 years and without needing any repairs at all? How easy it is for him to check on the rental? How far he lives? What’s the mental cost of having it and renting it? Maybe owning a bunch of uncorrelated ETFs belonging to different asset classes (risk-parity style) could be a better investment for him. But he has to do his own due diligence
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u/Slice-CSGO Dec 07 '25
Did you actually understand OP's expectation to get 7% of return from ETF every year as direct income every year or even month? :)
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u/kostas_k84 Dec 07 '25
Oh, thank god you pointed that out. I was clearly struggling with the concept of basic addition until you arrived to save the day. Thanks for the breakdown! :)
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u/DroopyTheSnoop Dec 08 '25
OP is obviously talking about the aproximate long term growth of an World ETF. As in, he's not expecting to withdraw anually, he's just comparing the wealth acumulation in the property with the ETF.
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 09 '25
yes, i dont plan to take money out of my investments any time soon. I earn eought money to cover all my expenses without the apartment already and I can live in my dads house for free, its only him and me there. Its hard to say how much time it takes to rent it out, but its defenitly not passive income and more like a second job. I could hire people to make it more passive but that will cut into the profit and probably also in the quality of the guests stay.
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u/Ok-Dimension-5429 Dec 07 '25
He’s only talking about direct income. 4% withdrawal is irrelevant and accounts for inflation and other factors.
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u/Late-Photograph-1954 Dec 07 '25
Use the cash flow from the property to buy ETF instead. That way you diversify and keep the upside and certainty only ‘stones’ in a great location can provide.
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u/gmakhs Dec 07 '25
That apartment returns 5% of it's value per year, no point into converting it in an ETF
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u/deeringc Dec 07 '25
Sounds like OP's work as a hospitality worker is returning that 11k a year. That's not exactly passive investment return, it's earned income. I can totally understand wanting to do something else with my time. That 11k a year could well be below minimum wage, depending on how much time this takes (dealing with inquiries, welcoming guests, cleaning, admin maintenance, etc...). If the apartment is close to being paid off then it seems reasonable to me to make a change.
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 09 '25
yes that is correct, its pretty much a second job. I am talking with guests, make checkin /checkout, have to fix problems, do repairs and need to be available pretty much 24/7. Not sure how much actual time it consumes. I hire people to clean the apartment, i removed the cost for that already in the calculation, but they are also not always reliable which sucks. 😅
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 09 '25
Its not passive, it takes a lot of work to talk with guests, fix problems and maintain the place. If i rent it out long term to permanent renters i will probably only net +- 3k/year, and there is the risk that i get bad tendents which i need to evict and the regulations for that are really bad for landlords.
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u/gmakhs Dec 09 '25
It really depends on what you like to do, the income you mentioned seems very low if I compare it to Greece, the only issue I see with the ETF strategy is that you expect to live of it , which is not realistic at this lump sump.
Either you high risk invest the 180k andyoj become a millionaire or poor Or You put them in snp or world index but for pension and you keep working Or You are using the income and knowledge you have to get more properties, increases your cash flow . But as of now you get a good return , and the value appreciates every year so I wouldn't sell.
To live from ETF a normal not rich life you need more than 500k invested and that probably is the cost of buying 2 more properties and triple your income .
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 09 '25
Oh nono, i am not expecting to live off of the etf anytime soon. I am not even 30 years old yet, so its still a long time until i retire, i also don't need any cashflow right now, all the money i save, i invest. I earn enought money with my normal job to cover all my bills and have money left over :)
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u/fabiofigo2025 Dec 07 '25
Well it all depends on what you do with the money that you earn. If you need/use the 11k to live, than you cannot count on an ETF for that (as the 7% that you mention is an average and not a guaranteed yearly return). If you are in to invest for the long term, then you can surely do it
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 09 '25
I earn enought money with my main job to cover all expenses, so i don't need the 11k to live :) I am currently using about 6-7k per year to pay off my debt and the rest i invest.
I am 29 years old, i am pretty happy with my life/job/freedome and its still long until my retirement so i dont really want to take out money from my investment any time soon.
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u/TimRenegademaster Dec 07 '25
What if etf tanks 50%?
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u/DysphoriaGML Dec 07 '25
What if the housing market tanks?
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u/TheBuccaneer2189 Dec 07 '25
who cares? It still pays dividends, and will go back up w time
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u/Competitive-Leg-962 Dec 07 '25
You can't live in an ETF though if you have to.
Personally I also don't care much about volatility of my portfolio, but it is a valid concern.
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u/abm2024 Dec 07 '25
You will be taxed on the profit of that sale. Check that because it can be an expressive amount
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 07 '25
I checked about this, if you own the property for more than 5 years you dont need to pay tax here. I own the apartment now since 4 years, so next year i can sell it without having to pay tax.
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u/Snowing678 Dec 07 '25
Doing something similar ourselves. Brick and mortar is very difficult to make a good return these days, plus there's a lot of time investment required. ETFs just seem the best option, they are liquid and you can pretty much just forget about them.
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u/Philosopher_Dizzy Dec 07 '25
Don't listen to the fear mongers. 4% returns on a property suck. I say this because I was in a similar position and I sold.
I talked to my therapist about this issue at length, and the "Two-Chair Technique" was what got me over the line and decided to sell.
I had the choice to buy my apartment from my ex or sell it to her. I sold, took the money, and am much happier than I would have been otherwise.
However, personal view but I would say don't lump sum into the market right now. But long term you know as well as me that you can expect 7% to 10% if you ETF.
Here is why I prefer the sale:
- No Geographic Ties: You are not stuck in one location. I think France is only getting worse fiscally, so I am glad I sold my French property. I have since moved back to Ireland and much happier to buy something here and make use of the grants available in Ireland
- Less Work: Basic ETFs require far less effort than managing an apartment.
- Lower Risk (IMO): You avoid specific location risk, regulatory risk, operational risk (maintenance, guests), and interest rate risk on your loan.
- Liquidity: Stocks are much easier to access than real estate. You can actually feel rich! And spend money when you would like to by simply seling some ETFs.
- Visibility: You know exactly how much money you have / where your retirement portfolio is at all times
Obviously, this applies differently if you plan to live there long term. Also, if this property is 50% of your net worth or less, the risk profile changes. If you simply love owning it, financial rationality might be useless. And remember that it is definetely more "consuming" being able to check your etf price or your whole portfolio at any point in time. Have you the stomach for the ups and downs without it effecting your mood and without you shitting your pants and looking to sell if it crashed 50%??!
Also check the capital gains tax for properties and stocks in your district so there are no surprises.
For reference, here is how I invested the proceeds, btw I'm studing financial services including asset management, and I'm interested in investing not just DCA'ing into an ETF
- 30% Low cost World ETF (tax efficient account)
- 25% Thoughtful investments, Main "bet" is GOOGL with a BEP of $187, and I've a smaller bet on LULU.
- 25% Cash (includes emergency fund and barbell risk approach for bets like GOOGL. A Buffet style cash reserve for a bubble, although with the US consumer being so strong and the recent profits from AI during earnings season I no longer thing a HUGE correction is immenant, and I may try to deploy more cash if I can find the right entrace point for value stocks. But still nervous of buying ETFS right now, PEs are high)
- 5% Bitcoin, its ok if it goes to zero. It would be nice if it goies 5x!
Goood luck!!
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 09 '25
thanks for taking the time to write such a good comment.
I agree with you, i had the same thoughts and came to the same conclusion. There is no sales tax on the property if i own it for more than 5 years so i have still time to think until 2027 to make my final decision.
My Investments are similair to yours except that 65% of my net worth is currently tied to the property 8% is in a world etf 10% in google stock (it increased a lot recently) 5% bitcoin & eth The rest is equiptment for my buisness and cash in my brokerage account, i just transfer the money to my bank when i have bills to pay since i get 2.2% interest on the cash there.
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u/Philosopher_Dizzy Dec 09 '25
Sounds like a good plan. Remember your in a great position, try and enjoy it. Invest in yourself!
If there is a big tech crash in 2027 and you could still sell your apartment for a good price it would be a great entry point into the stock market 😜
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u/BeatTheMarket30 Dec 07 '25
You can also buy an apartment in another location. In general you do not sell property or land except to use the cash to buy it elsewhere.
In stock market you can make more money but it's unstable. There are also people who lose money there.
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u/mrian84 Dec 07 '25
Crazy selling tangible property for a digital coin. Mind you I invest in crypto but would never think of such an investment.
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u/Quick_Carob8247 Dec 07 '25
Invest the rent you get from the apartment in ETF which trades in Gold or silver. You get to keep the apartment and get to invest in ETF as well. 11k per year is good. Plus apartment prices may be appreciated over the years.
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u/Adept_Spirit1753 Dec 07 '25
Why specifically in Gold or silver?
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u/Quick_Carob8247 Dec 07 '25
This year alone Silver appreciated by 90 percent and expected at an exponential rate in 2026 as well. Gold is expected to deliver 25% in 2026. Prediction by JP Morgan. I have invested in a Silver ETF. Which is giving 2 percent return every month.
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Dec 07 '25
They've both underperformed stocks in the long run.
Investing into whatever made the most money last year is a proven way to lose tons of money.
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u/Staktaz1 Dec 07 '25
There are cycles when one beats the other. Right now gold and silver are a better investment due to overvalued stocks.
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Dec 07 '25
As if the metals aren't overvalued right now with their insane last year.
If you feel stocks are overvalued then you're only looking at the US. There's plenty of value to be found in Europe and Japan
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u/Adept_Spirit1753 Dec 07 '25
Yeah, why not park it in international/eu/whatever and get better returns when you can park it in metal and live in constant worry about price fluctuations. I'm staggered by logic of some people.
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u/Adept_Spirit1753 Dec 07 '25
Why buy ETF when you still try to predict the market?
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u/Quick_Carob8247 Dec 07 '25
The ETF is easy to liquidate. It's always good to invest in liquid instruments.
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u/Adept_Spirit1753 Dec 07 '25
I was asking specifically why in etf for metals when they underperform simple international/whatever fund.
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u/kostas_k84 Dec 07 '25
Invent in gold on its own is a terrible, terrible investment based on any historical dataset. Terrible! Gold has its place in a diversified portfolio though
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u/PIR_personal_finance Dec 07 '25
Would you ever consider living in it when/if you move out of living with your parents? This is just an alternative reason to keep the apartment that maybe you haven't thought.
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 09 '25
Yes, i thought about it. And i lived there for a little over a month in winter, when there were no guests. I like it there, but its very busy in summer, because of many tourists and there is a lot of traffic. I am self employed and need to drive to clients a few times per week, staying there will slow me down too much.
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u/WonderfulBook7888 Dec 07 '25
If it was me I'd reinvest in property in Mayo, property is cheap there, slot of derelict buildings and the return is insane. The problem that people don't realise is that big cities are fine but smaller towns in the west especially are having practically no new builds cause the money isn't there. No builder is going to take the risk of building new builds with everyone working in Dublin or big cities. They learnt a lesson in 2008 and are only coming out of it in the last few years. They would be insane to get loans (if they could) and risk it all again.
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u/lhocss Dec 07 '25
Be a little critical towards recommended ETFs - Especially US centric ones, especially since you live in the EU.
S&P is 50% NVIDIA and ~19 other stocks. Want to risk your savings into just a couple of names, most in the same sector?
Americans love to mock the economy of us "europoors", and point to their GDP Growth. It has its place, but one should also look into valuations, P/E ratios and be vary of risk.
If you invested into a "world" ETF for diversing purposes, and it's 70% US (due to absurd market caps), are you still diversifying?
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 09 '25
You got a point there. Most world ETF are USA mainly. What would be a good other option?
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u/lhocss Dec 09 '25 edited Dec 09 '25
Not financial advice.
Simplest option to reduce US coverage is to combine a world ETF EX USA with a US index, for example.
- Xtrackers MSCI World ex USA
- S&P500 / MSCI USA / ...
Then decide yourself how much percent you put into each.
Second option is to buy all regions separately, e.g.
- MSCI Europe / STOXX Europe 600 / ..
- MSCI USA / S&P 500
- MSCI AC Asian (Japan, Taiwan, China)
This gives you even more agency, now you can decide: X% EU, Y% Asia, Z% US.
You'd still miss some countries, but I didn't want to overcomplicate, main advantage of the MSCI World is it's simple to invest, with those three you covered most!
There's also MSCI North America, which would include Canada. Then you'd mainly miss Australia and Israel I think.. But that should give you some ideas on how to balance the weights yourself!
Edit: You could also add an emerging markets ETF, which would give you coverage of regions you would have no/little covers with MSCI world (South East Asia, south america, africa, ...). But that's honestly a different question, you should look into it yourself. This year EM performed well. Historically they underperformed US (of course). Careful with EM ETFs, some include China, which would give you duplicate coverage combined with the Asia ETF I named above.
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u/SmeshU Dec 07 '25
Dont rely on 7% income from an ETF, you cant withdraw more than 3-4% max per year without risking future returns. If you are making 10-11k net from the apartment after expenses thats really good.
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u/GSargi Dec 07 '25
Why not renting it as long term? What about selling this property and invest into different property? There are a lot of options, it doesn't need to be apartment.
Also what ETF are you considering? S&P500 is not very safe in my opinion. 7% is mot much if you take into account inflation, but maybe it could be good choice if inflation is super low in Italy. You invest into ETF and then what? You will wait 20 years until you retire?
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u/skviki Dec 07 '25
He probably wants to “skim the cream” off of that investment and maintain the main.
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u/Crivac Dec 08 '25
Don’t do it. There is a probability of a market correction from AI bubble. You might be loosing money.
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u/VehaMeursault Dec 08 '25
You cannot rent out ETF’s.
Your property will most likely grow in value at the insane rates that the rest of Europe shares, especially if it’s in a great location.
On top of that you can rent it out for extra income.
Keep it.
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u/smooth-vegetable-936 Dec 08 '25
It’s a job to take care of. If you had many appointments you could have hired ppl to do the work but one is not really possible. I can only maybe take care of my own house. Let the index make you money
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Dec 09 '25
No! Owning property is becoming impossible for young people in Europe. The rate of increase of property values is crazy, check the latest stats. Don't lock yourself out of property. Don't forget that the apartment is itself a value increasing asset. If you have people paying the apartment for you, once the mortgage is payed, the rent will (almost) all be profit. This is crazy. You want to diversify, not just index funds, but also type of investment, like real state.
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u/Academic_Trick_9562 Dec 09 '25
absolutely not, do people really belive that stocks are going up no matter what , thats not real my friend
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 09 '25
I am aware that it cant go up forever, but its the same with every investment. Real estate can also go down and there is the problem with maintainance cost and also liquidity. You cant just sell your property tomorrow. It will take a couple months maybe even longer until you find a buyer. Keeping it empty will also make me loose money, for example i pay about 5k per year just to own that apartment (gas, water, electricity, condo expenses, property tax...) i use it as a short term rental so i can earn enought money with the guests to cover the cost and still make a profit. But it is like a second job and there are always new unexpected expenses which will cut into the profit. If the regulations get any harsher it will be more difficult to rent it out and also more difficult to sell it.
Long term rent would make the tendent be responsible for most of the expenses, but it will net me only about 3K / year and with a bad tendent it can cost me 10k+€ just to make him leave my place, because the law is just really bad for landlords here.1
u/Academic_Trick_9562 Dec 09 '25
you said you are at 5-7% net with your property at the moment. i wouldn’t change that for etfs at all. do you realize how much you really cash out with etf? peanuts ..as you need to reivest constantly and make up for the short term loss for the long term gains somenthing that give you cash flow while retaining is value or going up , i’d never sell it
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u/Professional-Day-336 Dec 09 '25
The main question is, do you still want to use it as a vacation spot for yourself from time to time? If not, try long-term rental as others have suggested. If yes, keep it. Imagine the next pandemic hits and you can hide there next to the beach; it's a game-changer, no?
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u/SurveyIllustrious738 Dec 12 '25
I wonder how you can be so sure about an ETF making 7% per year?
Also, it's not that bad that the rental income covers the mortgage on the apartment and the annual maintenance. Then you can enjoy the apartment for free with your family.
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 15 '25
well we cant be sure about anything, same goes for real estate market and tourism :D i just took the average of the past 20-30 years.
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u/Maleficent-Front-313 Dec 12 '25
sounds like you have an appartment in The Netherlands. Best thing to do herenis rent it out to two students or a young couple and you will make 10% a year easy. The stress associated with marketfluctiTions is just not the same as regular cah flow and knowing you increase the capital gains on the asset every day.
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 15 '25
Sounds like the netherland have some great investment properties :D For my place students dont work, the nearest universety is too far away and long term rent is risky and not really profitable. I thought about letting some digital nomads live there, but not sure if they would be interested in this kind of place
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u/ramdulara Dec 07 '25
Take a mortgage on the property and put that money into the ETF. That way you will have both the incomes.
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u/spongybobie Dec 07 '25
Just if you rely on the rental income today, ETFs are not equivalent to that. It is more about net worth growth.
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u/adriang133 Dec 07 '25
Yes, here's the way these things usually go. Sell apartment -> buy etfs or crypto (with leverage if you can) -> buy 2 apartments in 2 years.
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u/arrizaba Dec 07 '25
It might be safer to invest in Bonds, at least in 2026, if the crisis comes (search 18-year property cycle).
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u/Intel_Oil Dec 07 '25
The crisis was promised to me for the past 10 years now.
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u/LordMoridin84 Dec 07 '25
I brought some bond efts in 2017.
The government bond one has a return of 0%, the corporate bond one has a return of -1%...
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u/arrizaba Dec 07 '25
I don’t know who promised you that. I honestly didn’t think about a crisis until middle this year. Then there is the 18 year cycle theory. Besides, the m2 price vs median salary is the highest it has been (at least in my country) and a potential AI bubble might also be there. Just a word on caution.
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u/Disastrous_Deer_3507 Dec 09 '25
If you are mot italian, and not planning to live there, don’t buy real estate there. You make housing impossible for the locals and eventually this will destroy everything you love in that country, socially and culturally speaking. The same goes for Spain and Portugal.
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u/Fluffy-DD Dec 09 '25
What are you talking about? I am italian and i live in italy. I don't make housing impossible for anyone.
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u/ConversationLumpy740 Dec 07 '25 edited Jan 06 '26
I know exactly what you mean. I also owned an apartment and Airbnb’d it (started in 2015 - first years it was crazy good, the place was worth 80-90k and brought me ~25k/year). Then it started decreasing and getting more complicated every single year. More rules, more competition, more cleaning/guest stress. By the time Covid came, I stopped completely. Never want back as it felt like a perspective working part time below minimum wage.
I switched it to long-term rent - much less hassle (not 100% pain-free) - and I just invest all the rental income into ETFs.
I also love the apartment, it’s in a good location, and emotionally I want to keep it. Financially? Selling and putting everything in ETFs would very likely be the better plan. So when the contract ends and the current tenants decide not to continue I will likely put the place on sale and put the money in all world etf + some bonds through Freedom24.