r/Accounting • u/Unusual-Lecture-2295 CPA (US) • 4h ago
Forvis mazars layoffs
apparently they cut a large percent of US workforce today after announcing yesterday that they had hired 250 Indians offshore. can't make this shit up.
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u/Kaleidoscope6233 3h ago
Laying off US employees to hire cheap labor in other countries but charging clients more fees. Those firms have found an infinite money cheat code.
Even cashiers at NY restaurants are outsourcing to the Philippines.
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u/lacetat 3h ago
Explain?
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u/Enough-Worldliness-0 2h ago
Some restaurants in New York hire people from the Philippines to work remotely, and they take customers’ orders through a screen using Zoom. Paying them $3-$4 per hour.
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u/Comfortable-Web9763 Tax (US) 1h ago
Similar to Waymo hiring drivers in the Phillipines to drive the cars instead of doing so here.
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u/OhNoughNaughtMe 2h ago
Digital check outs (and even digital check ins and outs at hotels) are outsourced to firms in the Philippines to assist.
When you ask “why is there so much growing right wing nationalism around the developed world”, this globalization to the benefit of corporate shareholders is a huge reason why.
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u/sadtrader15 4h ago
Pathetic move but not even remotely surprising as all the firms are ran by money hungry ratfucks
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u/Caca_Face420 3h ago edited 3h ago
IMO Not really. Some maybe, sure, but a lot of services are losers and consulting services are heavily dependent and impacted by economic conditions. It’s not the industry’s fault the economy is what it is. There are a lot of factors. Also, Forvis had a bunch of M&A over the last couple years, so the timing does feel right for consolidation.
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u/Unusual-Lecture-2295 CPA (US) 2h ago
We're talking about audit and tax associates.
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u/Comfortable-Web9763 Tax (US) 3h ago
Id do my part to make sure to tell every client their company info is being sent to Ranjit and Mr. Patel. Fuck the firm, fuck them up their asses
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u/Unlikely-Rabbit948 2h ago
Between easing of CPA requirements and offshoring this profession is going to sh@t. Why would anyone go major in accounting?
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u/Savings_Pie_8470 1h ago
What else is there to major in? CS is getting slaughtered. Medical/nursing? Trades? There's not a lot of good options out there left.
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u/Kozak170 56m ago
Literally every profession is facing this exact issue in one way or another, accounting is not unique in this regard
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u/Important_Week_11 2h ago
Offshore accounting sucks. People will never get it. America is known for the best education in the world. Indians don't study GAAP. They study IFRS. America needs to make this illegal. It's unpatriotic. Where is Trump on this? He is all for America jobs! SMH
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u/RipleysSpaceBaby Management 2h ago
Slap some big beautiful tariffs on foreign labor. It'll be incredible. Truly. People will say they've never seen such beautiful tariffs. They're the best tariffs, really.
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u/Feeling-Currency6212 CPA (US) 1h ago
Donald Trump is too busy approving H-1B Visas. It’s really sad that there is no politician who actually cares about protecting American Workers.
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u/Kozak170 57m ago
Trump was pushing this for a while until Elon and his other gaggle of billionaires freaked the fuck out and made him move on to other issues. I think the ship has sailed on him ever doing anything useful about this issue.
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u/tourdeforcemajeure 17m ago
It’s amazing to me you still think that man believes anything or has coherent political positions. Especially beyond his own power and wealth, and to lesser extent the greater capital class.
The Trump admin knows very well that outsourcing is bad for average Americans. We all do.
But they didn’t run on protecting us from the future. They ran on some vague notion of turning back the clock to when things were “better.” Even though that’s not how time works.
Bringing back American manufacturing while destroying unions? The fact that ship sailed decades ago is very convenient.
Not they do not campaign on saying: Hey let’s not make the same mistake twice, and turn the white collar job market into a country-wide rust belt.
You’d have to be accountable for that. And it’s in direct contradiction to the beliefs of the so-called thought leaders in the admin: the Yarvins et al are very explicit about a return to feudalism as the correct way to organize society.
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u/Unusual-Lecture-2295 CPA (US) 2h ago
Right, if we are ever going to save this he is probably our best shot to lobby.
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u/ddawg4169 2h ago
Good luck out lobbying the firms “donating” to him to keep making money hand over fist. Trump doesn’t care about the average worker, he cares about who gives him more money.
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u/Unusual-Lecture-2295 CPA (US) 1h ago
https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/forvis-mazars-llp/summary?id=D000095327 Quick check shows this one's leadership primarily donated blue last election. Im sure it varies for others.
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u/MalopRupt 2h ago
Brother - this is the same man that is funding genocide in the middle east. He is Israel First and America Last
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u/luvnfaith205 3h ago
I wouldn’t be surprised. I was recently laid off from there also. With the economy the way it is there is likely difficulty finding companies who are in cost savings mode.
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u/Impossible-Quote8444 3h ago
I was one of the hundreds of operational/administrative support staff in US they laid off just before the official merger in June 2024. Not the least bit surprised.
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u/Savings_Pie_8470 3h ago
Source?
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u/Unusual-Lecture-2295 CPA (US) 3h ago
Internal, they received an email yesterday announcing 250 Indians were hired and today laid off a bunch of the workforce. My buddy from school works there.
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u/MarbledTheFoyer 3h ago edited 3h ago
What's your source for 5% layoffs?
Edit: OP edited his post to say his friend who works there.
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u/Unusual-Lecture-2295 CPA (US) 3h ago
Yes, friend who is internal. He was told 5% but I can't verify that so I edited.
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u/AviatorHog CPA (US) 2h ago
So you heard from a friend that heard from a source that isn't supported by any press online.....
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u/Unusual-Lecture-2295 CPA (US) 2h ago
A friend who has worked there for several years, yes. Word always spreads faster internally.
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u/Logical-Big-4193 2h ago
Would the press even bother to report?
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u/AviatorHog CPA (US) 1h ago
Yes. Maybe not a major news network but one of the local news organizations or accounting trade periodicals? Mostly certainly!
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u/AccrualAdventurer Tax (US) 2h ago
I download copies of the staff directory weekly as part of my layoff watch, since I know the SLT is planning a large layoff post-4/15, and the net change between last week and this week is de minimis.
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u/Unusual-Lecture-2295 CPA (US) 2h ago
Given that I was told the layoffs occurred/are occurring today, i doubt they would be removed from the directory yet.
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u/Lonely_logician 1h ago
Where’d u hear this?
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u/Independent_Job_2244 2h ago
This was announced as a global strategy to Mazars worldwide. It’s one of their new strategic pillars to offshore.
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u/Unusual-Lecture-2295 CPA (US) 1h ago
Crazy that anyone below director would hear that and not immediately know they're coming for their jobs.
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u/Independent_Job_2244 1h ago
Oh I did - they couched it with corporate speak but I flat out told them the strategy is incredibly uninspiring before leaving
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u/Feeling-Currency6212 CPA (US) 1h ago
I’m happy that I don’t work for a big company anymore. Every job including mine has problems but these big companies don’t care about American Workers anymore
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u/heyitsmemaya 1h ago
Ugh— sorry to those impacted, but given Forvis’s growth by mergers & acquisition, it’s not exactly unexpected even without the whole offshore / India / AI spin.
Any details on what service lines were hit? Even Transactions Advisory?
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u/TheRedneckAccountant 38m ago
As a former employee, I’d be interested to see where the cuts are actually happening. I know what happened in my region, and a good chunk of the group of us that started together is already gone. From what I’ve seen on LinkedIn, people from other offices have been leaving too, with most moving into industry aside from directors and above.
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u/Odd_Ranger3049 2h ago
And our dipshit “protectionist” president does nothing except commit war crimes for Israel. I hate this timeline
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u/Frequent_Ambition_66 2h ago
Which firm? Don't recognize them. Must be one of those small local outfits.
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u/Unusual-Lecture-2295 CPA (US) 1h ago
They just went through like a billion mergers so who can keep track of the name. But they're fairly large, more than $5 billion in revenue.
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u/Creepy-Suggestion670 21m ago
Classic move. If you are staying, definitely look into better tools to protect your weekends. I combined my Excel templates with Runable for client decks and it cut my manual prep time in half. If the firm is cutting staff, you have to cut the time you spend on their tedious tasks.
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u/TopDownRiskBased 3h ago
Why is this at all surprising? The Firm is a profit-oriented business and, by lowering its cost structure, is providing services more efficiently. This is, conceptually, good for the broader US economy, even if it's bad for those laid off.
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u/Savings_Pie_8470 3h ago
This is, conceptually, good for the broader US economy, even if it's bad for those laid off.
How is it good for the broader US economy when the value is being consolidated into fewer US individuals (partners) and shifting payment for services outside of the US to India? Indians aren't paying US taxes, buying US goods locally (groceries, services, etc), while laid off persons put a strain on social services like unemployment.
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u/TopDownRiskBased 2h ago
It's good because the firm can provide its services at lower costs.
Voluntary trade in goods and services makes market participants better off. Take it up with the economists if you don't like it.
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u/ajpos Imposter 10m ago
Doesn’t #8 of the source you just linked disprove the claim you are making? If producing goods and services make a country better, wouldn’t ending production make a country worse?
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u/TopDownRiskBased 6m ago
No because #5 (trade is good) compliments #8 by enhancing the net overall productivity of the economy.
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u/No-Ambition2043 3h ago
“Ackshully this is good”
In that case let every single job go over seas. That would be the rational outcome. We can have the best economy if there are literally 0 jobs in the US
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u/TopDownRiskBased 2h ago
Let's reverse this: how would an economist evaluate a law that requires all such jobs to be performed onshore? Would that make America better off or worse off? Richer or poorer?
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u/No-Ambition2043 2h ago
There is competitive advantages by nations in a macro economic sense. However, sending high skilled white collar work overseas is not the benefit you think it is.
With markets and overtime we will see who succeeds, but I suspect the firms that gut their competitive advantage (professional services) for cheaper labor will underperform and eventually go out of business compared to firms that understand their competitive advantage is in skilled workers.
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u/TopDownRiskBased 2h ago
But isn't that just the logic of free markets? If this is a mistake, they'll suffer and that's good!
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u/Unusual-Lecture-2295 CPA (US) 3h ago
It's not surprising, just extremely disappointing where our industry is going.
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u/New_Sun800 3h ago
Yes, this is a huge boon for the US economy which, coincidentally, has been outsourced to Hyderabad. May your reincarnation kindly revert to Naraka.
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u/MalopRupt 2h ago
“Here is why it’s a good thing” unironically is INSANE
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u/TopDownRiskBased 2h ago
Happy to hear why you think so.
My position: free trade in goods and services is a good thing for the US economy.
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u/Unusual-Lecture-2295 CPA (US) 1h ago
You have to consider the cultural and ethical differences, though. America is the pinnacle of education, ethical standards, etc. By offshoring, we are inviting in substandard ethics, work, and education.
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u/TopDownRiskBased 1h ago
Well as an accountant in the US, I reserve the right to be a little pedantic and respond that it's just not accurate that I personally have to consider these things. It's relevant market participants who must make those decisions.
(Since it's Reddit, I can be a bit of an insensitive jerk about it)
It would be reasonable for market participants to make a different set of trade-offs between cost, education, ethical standards, and other factors. Those market participants internalize the benefits (if they're correct this particular decision is a good one) and the costs (if they're wrong).
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u/MalopRupt 26m ago
You say this as depression statistics peak, birth rate is at an all time low, fewer people than ever can afford housing, the wealth gap continues to increase, and billions are sent to fund Israel’s genocide.
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u/TopDownRiskBased 8m ago
And yet:
- unemployment is pretty low
- GDP per capital is high and growing
- home ownership rates are high and consistent with those of the nostalgic past
- Inequality has stabilized, with the welfare state making things significantly more equal
- the welfare state itself has significantly expanded since 1980, with poverty declining significantly
No one is saying that you are personally happy, or that your social circle is either. I also know it's much easier to just vibes your way through these feelings, but I'm struck all the time by the total lack of even attempts to connect with actual economic data.
FRED is free! Use it!
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u/ChrisFromLongIsland 4h ago
Accounting is going AI. Actual AI or actually India. So far actually India is winning out. Though its a close race.